El Cid -starting out

[Alexmunky]

Ok following the wab campaign scrivs ran and the announcement the next one will be el cid based I find myself in need of an army, So can you guys could help me a few questions?

1. Andalusian horsemen- how is this played in wab 2? can you split into, and reform from, skirmish formation or is that not done anymore?

2.Andalusian archers and spearmen combined formation is this 'as above' the same as the christian spanish formation?

2a. is the unit bought as spearmen with rear rank archers and thats that or can I elect to field a spear 'block' and an archer 'mob' (the technical term) at the start of a game- that is - is it 1 unit no matter what or can it break into 2 during deployment?

3. al-andalus models I have been looking at the perry range and are the armenians or the arab militia better/worse representations of the al-andalus or something completely different?

[Gerontius]

NO idea about 2 and 3, I'm afraid - I'm thinking about an all-mounted Christian army for the event so I haven't even looked at the rules for infantry - but so far as I remember the answer to 1 is covered in the latest errata for El Cid (obviously downloadable from the WH website). Off the top of my head, I think Andalusian cavalry can still switch between skirmish and formed; it counts as a reform, so I guess would need a leadership test, but I may have read that section incorrectly.
Sorry - very vague. Someone more competent can undoubtedly offer more help!

[scrivs]

The supplement errata is here: http://warhammer-historical.com/PDF/WAB2superrata.pdf

1/ The Andalusian horsemen are the only troops in the game that can switch between skirmish and formed.

Replace the rule with Andalusian horses were the finest of their age, and highly sought after. Their natural agility and manoeuvrability made them ideal for the light cavalry tactics that typified Andalusian warfare. Any formed cavalry being noted as ‘Andalusian Horsemen’ benefits from the following:
1. Even if deployed in Open Order, the unit may break into Skirmish Order at the start
of its move. This may only be done when executing a normal move, and not when charging, fleeing or pursuing, for example.
Models in the unit can then move at double pace as Skirmishers.
2. The unit may Reform (see WAB page 23) after such a way, no model in the unit may exceed its permitted movement distance for this turn (i.e. the movement made during the
Reform manoeuvre counts as part of the movement of the turn, unlike usual reformations). No Ld test is needed to perform this reform manoeuvre. The reform may include a change from open order to skirmish formation and vice versa in an exception to the normal rules.
movement following a normal or march move (but not a fast march, charge, flee or pursuit move.) When reforming in such a way, no model in the unit may exceed its permitted movement distance for this turn (i.e. the movement made during the Reform manoeuvre counts as part of the movement of the turn, unlike usual reformations). No Ld test is needed to perform this reform manoeuvre. The reform may include a change from open order to skirmish formation and vice versa in an exception to the normal rule

3. Mounted characters accompanying an Andalusian Horsemen unit are assumed to
have excellent horses as well, and do not impede the unit’s ability to reform.

Note that the ability to switch from Open Order to Skirmish Order and back again is unique to Andalusian Horsemen and an exception to the normal rules. The intent is that they should be able to ‘flow’ around the battlefield, skirmishing and reforming.

2/ The combined formation is the one in the WAB 2.0 rule book.

The following rules have been superseded by WAB2:
Cavalry Counter-charges, Rank Bonus & Difficult Terrain, Reforming in Combat, Skirmishers & rank bonus, Fall Back in Good Order, Combined Formation, Ferocious Charge, Feigned Flight

2a/ I would say not, but Tom is running this one.

4/ I have some of the Armenians in my Christian Spanish too, lovely models. I would use both of them.

[Gerontius]

As I said - somebody competent! Think I may have to field some Andalusian allies in my Christian Spanish...

[TWD]

What Scrivs said.


With reference to 2a, you either pick a single combined unit, or you pick a unit of archers and a unit of spearmen. No combining/splitting them afterwards.

[Alexmunky]

magic thanks guys, and the other thing I just noted - if taking allies you can't buy allied characters but your own characters can join allied units- is that right? if so does the andalusian horseman rule extending to characters apply?

[scrivs]

I'd say not because they are not Andalusians

[FleetfootMike]

Useful thread, ta

I spoke to Forgeworld/WH again today to chase my order for El Cid, which had somehow got stalled in their system. Apparently they're down to, quote "low single figures" of the book.

[TWD]

Details for the event can now be found here

[Gerontius]

Put me down for it - PM me with your address and I'll send you a cheque asap.

[Alexmunky]

Looking good for 3 of team munky (outside chance of 4) Me and Pete again plus mike roberts will rally round and let you know at the end of april, might then buy an army and get a game in!

[James Morris]

Useful thread, ta

I spoke to Forgeworld/WH again today to chase my order for El Cid, which had somehow got stalled in their system. Apparently they're down to, quote "low single figures" of the book.

Fleetfoot Mike, drop me a PM if they can't deliver.

Cheers

James

[FleetfootMike]

Useful thread, ta

I spoke to Forgeworld/WH again today to chase my order for El Cid, which had somehow got stalled in their system. Apparently they're down to, quote "low single figures" of the book.

Fleetfoot Mike, drop me a PM if they can't deliver.

Cheers

James

Appreciate the offer - I'm assured there is stock, but the ordering system is being a bit confused, and if all else fails someone will walk down to the warehouse and stuff an envelope personally

[FleetfootMike]

While we're on the topic of El Cid armies... anyone any cunning ideas for plastic Jinetes conversions in 28mm? I'm toying with suitable Celtic cavalry with Norman-helmed heads....

[Gerontius]

I'm being really lazy and simply using the unarmoured figures from the Conquest Games plastic Normans with the spears cut short to represent javelins.

[FleetfootMike]

I'm being really lazy and simply using the unarmoured figures from the Conquest Games plastic Normans with the spears cut short to represent javelins.

Oh! I'd forgotten not all the figures in those boxes were armoured!

Good *call*, that man

[Codsticker]

I'm being really lazy and simply using the unarmoured figures from the Conquest Games plastic Normans ...

I am doing the same; I bought a bunch of Wargames Factory Persian bits on ebay to Jinete them up: javelins bows and heads.

[FleetfootMike]

I'm being really lazy and simply using the unarmoured figures from the Conquest Games plastic Normans ...

I am doing the same; I bought a bunch of Wargames Factory Persian bits on ebay to Jinete them up: javelins bows and heads.

What, you mean this box of WF Persian Cavalry here the one I'll be re-headding from the spares in my Numidian set as Parthians?

Good call

[FleetfootMike]

Appreciate the offer - I'm assured there is stock, but the ordering system is being a bit confused, and if all else fails someone will walk down to the warehouse and stuff an envelope personally

Finally arrived yesterday - many thanks for the offer though, James.

[Alexmunky]

One more thing.... If you do not take a character who is a general but then take one or more characters who can be a general do you have to upgrade one of them? - that is do you have to have a general?

And Team Munky is now looking like 1 almoravid (me) 1 anadalusian(Mike) 1 spanish(Bryan) and 1 who will be either andalusian or almoravid(Pete).

And Another thing bonus cards do we need units of skirishers again just in case?